Discipline Series 2: Family Discipline

We get honest about the hardest pillar in our discipline series: family, and the ways ambition and exhaustion can quietly pull us away from the people we love most. We share mistakes we have made, the lies we hear the most, and the simple habits that help us lead at home with more presence and purpose. 

• physical presence without mental presence and why leftovers damage connection 
• bringing the same intentionality home that we bring to work 
• treating your spouse like a problem to solve instead of someone to pursue 
• spotting the danger of “no conflict” and naming issues before resentment builds 
• date nights that work in real life and why a drive or walk counts 
• screen time escape and practical ways to reduce phone distraction 
• rethinking “moderation” and choosing what deserves your attention 
• common family lies like “they won’t remember” and “providing is enough” 
• parenting rhythms that matter: one-on-one time, routines, prayer, values 
• a simple weekly marriage check-in with questions to stay aligned 

Please subscribe, follow along. We’ve got week three next week of fitness, and then week four of leadership. So keep following along. If you missed week one, faith, take a listen 

Transcript

Welcome And The Family Pillar

SPEAKER_03 0:20

Welcome to the Rising Tribes Podcast. I am Nick Urankar with Braxton Cave, and we are on week two of our discipline series. Last week we talked about faith, so if you missed that, you can go back, take a listen. And today we are going to talk about family. Family, the messy one. It can be, anyways. Oh, unfortunately. Even when you are trying to not be messy, it's messy.

SPEAKER_00 0:45

Yeah, I think that this is always a good one, especially whether you're a man or woman that's a high achiever, the family one can often create, you know, the most angst within the household. And, you know, as we as we were going through and looking at, you know, doing some research and creating our notes, like there's I very easily could come up with like where this has been struggle for me. And where in areas where like I know it's a struggle, and then in areas where my wife has let me know where it's a struggle for her. And um, you know, especially, you know, as a a young dad and trying to figure it out with little kids, and even if you're just like new into parenting, like it's a whole new world. So you're just you're trying to figure things out. So it's never perfect. Like you can read every parenting book and have every conversation, but until you're in it, like you don't you don't know what you don't want to do.

SPEAKER_03 1:45

And yet somehow, as a parent or a spouse, you at some point end up saying, I wish somebody would have told me that. Yeah. Yet the whole way you're every day someone's telling you something, and uh yet we we miss what we need. We feel like we need. I wish I would have listened to that. Ah, I know. Well, that's what's so interesting about you think oh, I'm you know, whether it's you're dating or and you're getting ready to get married, you think you got it figured out, and then you realize like you are two completely different people trying to figure out how to build this one life. And then you think you're ready and you or not ready, and you add kids to the mix, and you realize you don't know how you are as a parent until you have a kid.

Home Without Being Present

SPEAKER_00 2:31

Yeah, so I'm gonna I wanna jump right into these five, and we can talk through them as we go, but um, I think a lot of people will resonate with some of the struggles that I have felt and and have experienced myself. And the number one being, you know, early in my professional career, you know, my corporate career, um, you know, spending long hours in the office, getting home, young kids, and it's like by the time you get home, you're just like like ready to take a deep breath. And so it falls in in my in my top two. The first one, physical presence without mental presence, like you're home, but you're not actually there. Like how often do you get home and you just like after a long day, you sit on the couch and you just like space out, right? Um, and then so the second one is you know, you lead, you're in these positions, maybe you're in a position of leadership at work. So all day long you're communicating and leading, and you know, have to be you have to be everything to everyone, and then by the time you get home, you got nothing left to give to your family. I think those two kind of go hand in hand. And I experienced those in a real way um early on in in Natalie and I's marriage and and in my you know professional career.

SPEAKER_03 3:48

Isn't it interesting just the way to say that I have nothing left to give. It's always trying to figure out how at the end to give the leftovers. And I think that that's a that is a a spot that if you are somebody who has said that, that's a a spot to reflect on. Right. If you're thinking I don't I don't have enough to give, I'm giving so much everywhere else, how am I supposed to do this? I think that for me, I we actually haven't had the women on in a long time. Now I'm speaking about family, we we should bring our wives on. But I don't think my wife would ever say Nick has told me he didn't have enough to give. Like that he I never use that as an excuse. And and and I say that because I think when talking about you know having the physical presence, but maybe without the the mental um coming home from a busy day um and just wanting to just unwind. And a lot of times we focus so hard on being perfect for people who really don't care much about us, and then the ones that do care, we think that we can show up less than and they're gonna be okay with it because we show up so much for them around other people.

SPEAKER_00 5:11

Yeah. I would say I've never verbalized to Natalie or the kids that I have nothing left to give, but I would say my actions said different. And I I feel like a lot of us, you know, especially from a men's point of view, like I'm never gonna verbalize that because I'm like, no, I can I can do it all. Like I've I've got all this energy, I'm never gonna, you know, back down. Or but when you get home and you're just zapped and you, you know, to me it it boils down to like you intentionally made time throughout your day for other people. Like you have to have the same bring that same intentionality home and have purpose. And we I mean it's you know, if you're lucky, you get like two hours with your kids, you know, depending on what season of life you're in. You know, like you've talked about nights where Jay has dance and stuff, and you don't even she's doesn't get home until you're in bed. Like you don't even get that. So seeing her. If you go days without the ability to even have that interaction, to then get it and then not take advantage of it, like you're you're intentionally wasting that time. And I think that's honestly what it boils down to. It's like you you have to be just as intentional with the time at home. Some people go as far as they schedule it, right? Like it's it they put on the calendar, and that works for some people, and some people maybe it doesn't. But if that's the extreme you have to take it to to make sure that you're filling that gap, then I think it's a hundred percent worth doing that.

SPEAKER_03 6:51

Yeah, I think a lot of times I don't know many people that actually take the time to try to schedule it out. I think they say they're going to. I mean, how many people have you talked to have been like, yeah, my wife and I have talked about going on a date night, we just haven't got to it.

SPEAKER_02 7:04

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_03 7:05

Like, you know, I'm gonna date my I want to take my kids out and go to different places or do these things, but like we haven't done it yet, but like we've talked about.

SPEAKER_00 7:14

Right. It's it I I go back to I keep seeing these videos on Instagram, and you may have talked about this before, but you know, they'll be like, hey, try to pick that up. And they lean down and they pick it up. And he goes, No, no, no, put it back down. Try to pick it up, and they pick it back up. And he's like, No, like try to do it. And he's like, I I I did it. Like, and he's like, Exactly, like, there is no trying. You either do it or you don't. And I'm like, it's that's when any anytime I hear someone say I'm trying to do whatever, it's like, no, you're either doing it or you're not. And like, what's your intentionality behind it?

SPEAKER_03 7:52

Yep, and that's where I mean when it comes to a marriage, there are there's a lot more trying that we like to admit, meaning we're thinking about it. You know, uh I would text my wife, I love her, but she hasn't texted me in a long time. So like I'm just you know, I thought about it, but I didn't do it. And for me, I'm very much a person like I and I say this a lot, like you have to accept what you're doing. So example, if I'm like, oh, I'm gonna try to be a better husband, well, are you? What are you doing? And do you accept that you're not doing something or you are doing something? And I talk to a lot of people, and I'm the same way, like there are certain things that I do not do that other people that people think I should, but I'm like, no. And I I know I'd be a better I'd be a better person if I did it, but that's just I I do so many other things that I can accept that I will not that I can give that up, and I think that's hard in a marriage. Um, like example, I for myself with my wife, like I will allow her to go off, she's actually taking a road trip today just to have some of her time a hundred percent. But I know certain people that would not allow their spouse to do that, and I know for me, like there are times where I will say to her, like, you know, I just need to like get away for a few hours, and she's totally fine with it. Is is that best for my kids? Like, if they're like, Oh, I want to play on my guys, I need I need this, and I and I'm willing to make myself better by getting away sometimes and come back more full. Um I think sometimes

Fixing Mode In Marriage

SPEAKER_03 9:40

we don't do that for ourselves, especially with our family. We don't give them the space that they need and give ourselves the space that we need.

SPEAKER_00 9:47

I should have started this with like, these are the top five mistakes I've made and learned from. Um so the third one on this list for me is you know, treating your wife like a business partner instead of a person you're pursuing. And when I think of that one, it's for a living, I'm paid to solve problems. And so, you know, when when the dust settles and Natalie and I are catching up at the end of the night, and you know, she just wants to talk to me and bounce things off me, and and nine times out of ten just wants me to listen. I'm always like, well, then you need to do this, this, this, and this. No big deal. Like, it that's it. Like, and that is not what what she wants, um, to where like I can treat what's going on in her life or things that she wants to talk about as like very transactional, like I'm back in the office, and that's not that it's never been a recipe for success in our marriage.

SPEAKER_03 10:49

Do you so in that are is there any way to pull yourself out of that? Um that reaction?

SPEAKER_00 10:57

It sounds cliche, but I've I've started when she brings things to me, and I'm not perfect at it, I still mess this up all the time, but I've been better at like just asking. Like, do you want me just to listen, or are you asking me to like help you solve this? Most of the time it's listen because my solve is typically not what she wants. Because a lot of things she's like, she'll say something. We we just had this conversation like maybe this week or last week, like she brought something up, and I really quickly like spouted off, and she's like, Like, I knew you were gonna say that. Like, I knew that's how you were gonna react. And um, so again, admitting my faults here, but um, and it's something I gotta continue to do better, but listening and just understanding where she's coming from because like we're completely different people, you know. Her the way her brain works and the way mine works are completely opposite a lot of times, and and where I want to solve, like she just wants to like get it off her chest and talk about it, and that's never been like a great uh strong trait of mine.

SPEAKER_03 12:10

Yeah. Well, and I uh in our household it's slightly different because my wife is like gung-ho in real estate, entrepreneur. Um, so when it's to me, when I hear, you know, treating your wife like a business partner, my wife is constantly like, okay, there's this thing I'm dealing with, and I'm and I'm basically like her right-hand man. Um, it's not that I'm fixing it, but it might just be like, hey, did I word this right? Like, how's this email sound? This is what I want to do, like, this is the thing I'm working through. And and I think as uh as partners, we have to be able to pull ourselves out of doing that and making that the norm. And I think for us, because she's so big into what she's doing, and I have the ability to sit and listen and help, and our day can turn into it's just business. And the dating aspect, I think when people say, like, oh, we go on weekly dates or oh, we do these things, it's not it's it's not about the act of going out. It is the act of dating. It is the act of saying, hey, I see you more than what the day shows. Because I think some days it just shows as like, hey, I'm just trying to get to a certain point, trying to get a win, right? Like, hey, we solved that problem, sweet, good. And we miss out on the on the relationship side, on the it is us. And I've struggled with that all the time. I mean, we I know you are you guys are really good at your like Thursday date nights. Um, and Chelsea and I go through ebbs and flows of like these are our date nights. However, we get to spend a lot of time together. But a lot of that time is spent talking. I mean, it could be 9:30 at night, and she's in bed and she's like, uh, I just got an email. And and we may have not talked at all about anything going on with us. And I think a lot of times that's easier.

SPEAKER_00 14:10

That kind of leads me right into these last two, and I'm I'm gonna combine these last two because they go hand in hand, and it's uh assuming the marriage is fine because there's no active conflict, and you know the idea that silence in marriage, you know, isn't peace, sometimes it's distance dressed up as peace. You know, and I think a lot of times, especially with men, like we can think, oh well, my wife's not complaining about anything, so like I'm everything must be good. Um and Natalie and I have had that before, you know, and and this is where I have to have a con I always have the conversation with her of like, if something's bothering you, like you have to tell me. Like, don't wait until it becomes a a thing before and you want to like cut my head off before like you bring it to my attention. Because at the end of the day, I'm an imperfect human and I and I don't I don't see everything. Though I I will pride myself on that I see more now than I used to, I'm still not great at it. So that's a a constant, like, you know, if I want to call it coaching that I give her for our marriage of like, if something's bothering you, please bring it to my attention because if you know that's that's the trap that we often fall into of like we're not arguing, you know, sh everything seems to be cool, but on the uh you know, whether it's the man or the woman, like there could be silently something going on that they're upset about or hurt about that they just haven't brought to light, and you're sitting here like, oh, things are awesome, you know, things are good.

SPEAKER_03 15:49

Since we started dating, um I I'm kind of I don't know if I'm aware of this or I've I've seen it or I think I've seen it, I'm naive to to believing it, but I I think that it's true. Most marriages I don't think end because of active conflict, because of a large thing. Yet, yes, there there are those. I think most end because of something small that built up to something that can't be looked past. Um, so it's those small things. And it's for me, I always tell Chelsea, I'm like, hey, I might go two or three weeks, but I'm gonna bring it up if there's something, because I don't want this to become bigger than what it should. I think people build up resentment. I think in marriage, especially, uh, we watch things happen and we judge. And if we don't speak up or say anything, it can affect it. So I'm very much on the side of I'm whatever I'm thinking, whatever I'm feeling, I'm trying to let you in and let you know. And that's the part of it where when you become business partners, when you're just becoming like, hey, we're just we're passing through, we're divide and conquer, or you know, hey, you grab this, I'll do this. We miss the being active in the marriage. There doesn't need to be an active conflict to be active. And a lot of times, once I open up and I say something, she'll be like, Yeah, well, just so you know, there's this. And you're like, oh my gosh, I didn't know because I'm so focused on how I'm feeling and what I'm dealing with. And I'm like, okay, well, I need her to know this. And then she tells me something where I'm like, dang, how didn't I see that? And then I'm so focused on me. We need to be active in seeing each other. So that's what I think about when I think, oh, there's there's no conflict, there's always something. Um, and something may affect how she's feeling about me because maybe she's dealing with something and I'm not saying the right thing, I'm not giving her what she needs. And it's asking, like, like you said, what do you need from me today? Is it just an ear? Um, I used to do that a lot more with Chelsea, but I think I'm uh an ear for her, so where sometimes I'm like, hey, you haven't asked me about anything.

Date Nights That Build Connection

SPEAKER_00 18:10

Let's go back to the the date night conversation. Yeah, um, just because I think that has been such a pivotal, pivotable, pivotal moment in our marriage and in our journey. Um hopefully Jake can edit that out.

SPEAKER_04 18:28

No, you gotta keep it.

SPEAKER_00 18:30

Uh that, you know, and speaking of like ebbs and flows of life, like Copeland's baseball schedule has recently shifted. So our Thursday date night has now shifted to Wednesday date night. Um, but it's again it the intentionality behind it and it stays on our calendar. And whether it's like we love, you know, Natalie and I love the to get away, just the two of us, because we just don't get that that time very often outside of like our catch-up before bedtime when once the kids go to sleep. But we also have realized that one of the cool things we've realized is that though we love spending one-on-one time with each other, like we also really love spending time with other people. And so sometimes our date nights are one-on-one, but a lot of times our date nights are with friends. And so I think a lot of people, I think you also have to be very intentional about that because it's so often you can get in this routine of like going to parties or going to events or going to dinners with other people, and you end up not really spending any time together. You spend it, you know, more like talking with someone else, making it an event where you're not actually together. Right. So we we always try to do a really good job, whether it's just us or we're with other people, of like it's knowing that it's our time, and that's been really helpful um for our marriage and us just staying connected.

SPEAKER_03 20:02

Yeah, I think a lot of our in a in a date night doesn't have to be dress up and go to dinner. Um, just not that long ago, Chelsea and I just kids were busy. Now we're in that stage where they both went to the movies with friends and we were like, let's go take a Michigan Day. We can have fun driving 30 minutes in the car, listening to music, cracking jokes, laughing, and just letting our guards down and being with each other in just the moment. And I think sometimes going on a drive, uh, I know my dad, they don't go out to eat, they don't go, they don't have a whole lot of friends that they hang out with. What they do is they drive. They get in the car and they drive, they listen to music, they talk. I think a lot of times we think date night or we think time with our spouse has to be this special, amazing occasion. And the truth is it just needs to be you together. And a lot of times it has to be you together in an environment that isn't normal. So you do it in your living room, you're probably gonna turn on the TV, and it becomes the two of you in the TV in the same room. So going on a walk, going you know, going to a coffee shop or a restaurant or a place where you can be together is cool, but it doesn't need to cost money.

SPEAKER_00 21:19

It's um getting out of like it's just getting out of your usual routine. Right. I think like Natalie and I have done in-home date nights, it's which is it's great if that's what you need to do in a crunch, but like it's there's something about just getting out of the house or getting out of like the norm because you know you're you're you find yourself in these default spaces all the time, uh, which then lead to a lot of times the same conversations or um bringing up the same things as you would in the normal day to day. So I think there is something to like getting into a different space. And again, like it doesn't have to cost money, like getting out of the house and going for a walk is Getting somewhere new.

SPEAKER_03 22:01

I mean, we have some of the best conversations on walks.

SPEAKER_00 22:04

Let's talk about this one, and I want you to talk about it first because you do a way better job at it than I do. Um, but the the screen time escape, or like the your phone as the third person in the room. Like, how do you how do you manage that? What does that look like for you?

SPEAKER_03 22:22

That's a good question because I don't really know how I manage it other than I think having, I mean, I've been on social media now um 2012, I would say is when I first started on social media, and I didn't didn't make any sense to me. That was stupid. Double tap for a heart. Like, come on, guys, like really. Um, but I think what ended up happening was it was Facebook, I think, is what fixed me. You're gonna be like, Facebook fixed you. Um, it was maybe

Phones As The Third Person

SPEAKER_03 22:55

2014, maybe 2013. Um, and I started getting some followers on Instagram, and then I started getting people who were asking to be my friends on Facebook. So I thought Facebook and Instagram were like the same kind of thing. You just okay, these people, but I was like, why can't these people just follow me? Like it would be way easier if they could follow me like they can on Instagram. So all I would do is I'd have like 300 people asking to be my friend, and I would just add, add, add, add, add, add, add, add, add. And Chelsea would always be like, Nick, look at this. Did you even look at these this picture of this girl? Like, look at she fall, and I was like, no, it's a circle, it's super small. I don't pay attention. She's like, but look. I'm like, I'm honestly not, I'm just adding everybody. And then all of a sudden, crazy as it gets, there's it says you can no longer add anybody because there's a 5,000 person limit. So I was like, shoot. Then I found out that Facebook is actually a space for friends. So what happened was I this is the time when people would like, oh my gosh, you see this person from high school, or you know, there was like kind of reminiscing, and then you'd connect with old friends or family, and I didn't have that. So all of a sudden I've got thousands of people on Instagram that I don't know. And I had hundred and fifty people on Facebook that were from like college and family, and I would share pictures when Jada was born, but it just like flipped out of my head. And I realized like I need to actually talk to these people, like I have to actually like contact them and call. I and I told myself, I'm not I'm not going through Facebook and deleting all these people, and most of them don't even speak English. So if you go on my Facebook feed, it's like you can't understand anything. You know, if you're speaking English, you don't know what's being said, who these people are. And what it basically just showed me is I don't need to be connected with people that I'm not even connected with. So for me, it's really hard to go on Facebook and look at stuff from somebody I haven't talked to. Some of them I've never talked to, and I just knew their name. And others we had a relationship and it it separated because I no longer competed, or I moved. And if I want to know something about somebody, I just type their name in and I will reach out. So for me, social media has become a I consume or I create, or I do neither, and I don't want to consume. So I'm vo I'm more of like they say, we've talked, like if you're a runner, just say I'm a runner. Uh if you ask me like what about it, I just I don't consume it. I don't find value in it. Um, and if I do, I consume what I want. So I consume podcasts, I consume books. Um if I find something, I might go and look on a page to see like, oh wow, can I get inspiration of this? Like I will go onto a page, I won't just scroll. And if I scroll, I remind myself, this isn't what I do. So in long story, I have just made this mentality that I am not a consumer of content that is placed in front of me by somebody else's choice.

SPEAKER_00 26:12

Yeah, I mean, it's I I take full responsibility for my diagnosis of FOMO.

SPEAKER_03 26:21

I don't have that.

SPEAKER_00 26:23

And I and that's where like what's sad is it's become just like this unconscious habit of like if my phone's on me, like I'm not even thinking, like I will reach for it, and and I don't keep any of my social media like on my homepage of my phone, but like I will know how to get right now. Yeah, I swipe down and I so and I search it. Do you put your phone up or down when you set it on a table? Um, where's my phone? I don't even know where my phone has. As long as he's got his iPad in front of him, so he pops up. Um usually I don't know. I don't pay attention to it.

SPEAKER_03 27:06

You have your phone up, I know.

SPEAKER_00 27:07

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 27:08

Because I'm aware. Because I have my phone down. So there's you know, the research is if you like if you're holding it and you're it's like almost 100% you're gonna look. If it's face up, it's like over 60 or 70 percent that you're gonna pick it up and look at it. And if it's down, the percentage of you looking at it significantly drops. And then the next is you take put it in a different room. So I actually put it down face down, and I don't have the vibrate like really long. So like when it's we know, we know you. So when it's down, I I have absolutely no idea if anything is happening. Um, and I don't want to grab it. But when it's up, if I accidentally do this, it kicks on, and I can see it. And I naturally in my head, it's weird. Just flipping it upside down for me shuts me off because I know I have to pick it up and it looks intentional. Like I'm I feel rude. I feel like oh, I'm doing something wrong if I pick my phone up.

SPEAKER_00 28:09

Yeah. I mean, for those of you that don't know Nick, Nick is notorious for not answering his phone the first time you call him. He he typically calls back within like 30 seconds, but he never answers the phone the first time.

SPEAKER_04 28:20

Not on purpose, it's not like I see you calling and I'm like, oh, I'm not gonna answer it.

SPEAKER_00 28:24

Um but do not disturb my phone goes on do not disturb when I'm in church. I had my phone on do not disturb for like a year and a half and didn't know it.

SPEAKER_03 28:36

Okay. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 28:37

And then mine goes on do not disturb while I'm like during sleeping hours. Um, so that's that's really it.

SPEAKER_03 28:45

People who are around me enough crack jokes like Braxton just did about me and my phone. When I was leaving, Chelsea's like, Your phone's broken. She that's what she says. My phone's broken.

SPEAKER_00 28:55

Yeah, what's funny is you know, if Chelsea needs to get a hold of Nick, she'll call me. And and I can't.

SPEAKER_04 29:02

He's not wrong. He'll just be like, call your wife. Yeah, and then I look and I have three calls, four texts.

SPEAKER_00 29:09

But you know, something that really stood out to me recently is you know, my wife just recently deleted social media off of her phone. Which is pretty cool. And you know, I asked her, you know, more about that, and she said, you know, I'm I was you were at work, I was home, the kids were here playing in the pool, like belly laughing, and she goes, I was sitting over on one of the pool chairs, just scrolling away on my phone. And like out of my, you know, I could hear the kids in the background like laughing and having so much fun, and I'm sitting here like not even enjoying these moments, and that's what and she just deleted it right then and there. And you know, I it makes me just often think about like how much how much do I miss because you know, my eyeballs are in my phone, or I'm scrolling, or reading emails that are not even, you know, important at that time. And um, you know, I think it's this is definitely an area where I can always do better of you know putting my phone away, having the designated hours. You know, I've even gone as far to, you know, there's um there's like these stands that you can put on your wall and you put your phone in it, and it basically like it's like use use when you're home, use your cell phone like it's a a wall phone, a house phone. Like it's an old like this is your designated area where you can use your phone and you know, but don't like walk around the house with it. Don't sit on the couch with it.

SPEAKER_03 30:42

Like if you're gonna use it, fine, do it right here and you know, use it like we did when we grew up in the 90s with you know wired connected to the I I always I remind myself, I've never now obviously there are things that happen, there are very important things that you might miss, but I've never been hanging out with my kids and doing something and then been like, oh shoot, I didn't see that post right when it was made. Like, never am I mad going and grabbing my phone and opening up a social media app and being like, dang, this was more worth it. Like I look at social media, like we've talked about this, like how um I wouldn't say like I had an alcohol problem, but I know that like I don't like how I am when I drink as compared to when I don't. And it's the same thing, like I don't like how I am with social media than when I'm not. Like I I I could see easily not being present and not being there in moments that I've got some amazing memories. Um like going to like the water, we went to a water park a year and a half ago, and we put all of our phones in the locker for like eight hours. We didn't miss anything. Yeah. Like how when was the last time you didn't have your phone on you for eight hours?

SPEAKER_00 32:06

Um there was actually a couple times recently where I've left, we've left the house and I left and forgot to bring it up. Isn't it scary? Like the first like minute.

SPEAKER_04 32:14

Right? You're like, should I go back?

SPEAKER_00 32:16

And I mean, and then I just I look around the car and I'm like, I mean, everything I need is right here. And um, you know, like you said, very rarely does something come up where it's uh like a 911. Um, and if that where if someone needed to get a hold of me, you know, I would say 99% of those the person would call Natalie's phone, right? Um, the 1% of things on a work side that would come up that need addressed with that kind of urgency are would be very rare.

SPEAKER_03 32:48

There was a there was something that hit me years ago, um, and it was from Tony Robbins, and it made me kind of rethink a lot of stuff. Even even like coffee and in relationships, and like we're talking about family. A lot of times we we say we do things in moderation, right? Like, oh, well, you know, yeah, I know I'm on social media a lot, but like I know worse. Or like, oh, I'm on my phone, or like, oh no, but my wife and I aren't like that, or our kids are this way. But the truth is, moderation, the definition that we place on moderation, think about it. You would say, Oh, uh, I drink coffee moderately. Well, it's moderation, two cups a day, maybe three or four. But that's moderate, right? We somebody could be like, Oh, I I drink alcohol moderately, one to two drinks a day. Or, well, but you don't say that, you're like, oh, like three or four days or whatever. But is it moderation? So when when the definition of like, wait, when we say we do something in moderation, what is our definition? And when we say that, place that on all the things in our lives, and we'll realize very few things do we do in moderation.

SPEAKER_00 33:54

I think we look at moderation as anything less than extreme.

SPEAKER_03 33:58

Yeah. And even if it is, we say it so that we don't feel extreme. Yeah, that's so true. Because I would say like I'm on my phone way more than I should be, but I'm on it way less than others, yet I still know I could be better. Like you said, uh I'm way better at that. Well, yeah, however, I'm also in a completely different like most of my business is on there, so I I view it, I view social media as a business. I every single thing that I see scrolling across my face is somebody demanding me to stop. And I don't want somebody demanding my time because I'm doing the same thing. I recognize that. When I make a post, I don't look at, I look at like, okay, I had X amount of people who viewed something, but did they did they act how I wanted them to? And when you look at it like every single thing being placed out in front of you is to get you to do something. Are you doing it? And the number way of knowing it is are you seeing it? And if you're seeing it, then you have the opportunity to do what they want or not. And I just want to choose to not put be put in a position to have to make that choice.

The Lies We Tell Ourselves

SPEAKER_00 35:07

I want to read to you some of the top lies that people believe about family discipline. And I want to hear like what your I'm gonna read it, read one at a time, and I want you, I want to catch like I want to capture from your experience like what your what your response back to this person would be.

SPEAKER_03 35:27

Oh geez. Well you gotta do it too. Alright, I can do that. We'll we'll alternate. I'll do the first one, you do the second one. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 35:35

So the first lie would be I provide financially for the for my family. That's enough.

SPEAKER_03 35:44

I mean, I think that that's a scorecard. So I'd say if you're using the like, well, I work, I do these things, um, you're in the wrong game. I there is no scorecard. There isn't because here's what I would say. If you couldn't provide and you couldn't do those things, then what? I I don't want my wife to have to feel like she needs to perform or be anything other than her. And if I'm tired and I'm struggling because of those things and I can't provide, I want to be open and say, like, hey, here's where I'm struggling. And she might say, You need a different job. If you can't be who we need you to be, you maybe need to be doing something else. So I would say, like, I don't have scorecards, and that to me is like a number one, like, hey, I get extra points.

SPEAKER_01 36:41

That's a good answer.

SPEAKER_00 36:43

Thanks, Megan. Your turn.

SPEAKER_03 36:46

Okay, well, which were we at? Where are you at on this?

SPEAKER_00 36:49

Segment two.

SPEAKER_03 36:50

Okay, I'm too far down. My kids are young, they won't remember this.

SPEAKER_00 36:57

I would my my go-to here is always when it comes to kids, more is caught than taught. And I my own learning experience on this with our kids, especially my oldest, she remembers everything. Like, she can recall stuff from when she's like three years old. And she's nine now. And she'd be like, Remember that time when this and I'm like, Oh my gosh, how does she remember that? Um, but I think you may be right, like they may not remember the actual thing, but they and this doesn't just go for kids, this goes for for adults and and everyone. People may not remember the event, but they will always remember the way you made them feel. And we can trick ourselves into thinking, oh, you know, I'll miss, I can miss the baseball game because they won't they won't remember this one. This is one of a hundred baseball games. They know whether you were there or not. They might they may not remember that game, but they're gonna remember the way they felt when they looked in the stands and didn't see mom or dad. And so, and that's not a I don't want I don't want people to take that as like a guilt trip because I know there's people that travel for work and there's things that happen, but at the end of the day, like that's one of my biggest memories growing up. Like my parents were at everything. I I here you go, this is a perfect example. I vividly remember when I was 12 years old, I played on a travel baseball team. It was my first travel baseball game. I slid into home plate and broke my leg. My parents weren't there. And you know, call that like happened by chance, call it whatever you want. But the my biggest takeaway from that was like it was like one of the only games I remember my ever my parents not being at for whatever reason it was. And I rode in an ambulance to the hospital with my buddy's mom because my parents weren't there. Now I don't hold that against them, but it's part of your story. But it's part of my story, yeah. I remember I remember that. Um, so I would just I I just lean I go back to always like more with our kids, especially more is caught than taught. Isn't it so crazy though?

SPEAKER_03 39:14

And I think if you're listening and you're a parent, um if if I think we all believe more is caught than taught, yet we all try to teach like we would rather stand out there and and tell them what to do than to be out there doing it with them. Right.

SPEAKER_00 39:34

Um I think that's exactly why we're talking about you know the the disciplines of all these pillars, right? It's what standard are you setting for your family? What example are you setting for your family?

SPEAKER_03 39:46

Like that's we can say whatever we want. How many times do you tell people or tell your kids this is what I hope for you, and what you're saying, you don't even do? Like that's what it is, it is a I am very aware that I do not want to ask of my kids what I will not ask of myself.

SPEAKER_00 40:08

And trust me, I mean I see it more now than ever. Um, you know, helping coach my son's baseball teams and being around some of these parents, you like you hear people yelling this like, Timmy, get your elbow up. I'm like, come on, guys, like get your elbow up is a horrible piece of advice to start with. Um, but like so many parents, especially like in the sports environment, put these pressures on their kids to live to this standard that like their parents never said. Um and that's probably easy for me to say, like being a you know, former professional athlete, like that's you know, the 1% of 1%. I'm not saying that you had to be that person, but like man, if you're if you're holding your kids to an expectation that you could never hold yourself to, like that's the first problem.

SPEAKER_03 40:58

Yeah. And I and it's also to say that there is no right or wrong in like how you do this. Meaning, like for myself, our view on education is I believe that all families, and this is another point, we you need to be having conversations on like who are you as a family? Who are we as a unit? Who are we as a couple? Um, what are our values? And I think like for Chelsea and I, ours is more about effort, like let's talk about grades, like more about effort than grades. I don't care if you flunk if I know you gave everything you could and you just got an F because that's not how you're gonna be graded out in the real world. And I think a lot of times kids can just skate by with no effort, do well and be like, hey, you got good grades, and they get praised, but I I praise off effort over results because the results will come. And I we like I tell my kids, I'm like, I would rather you just get C's and learn how to how to learn, how to approach something, um, how to give forth effort in what and you see that when I do, this happens, and when I don't, this happens. So it becomes your choice. So I mean, like, and I know some households they are like grades are everything, and there's nothing wrong with that. Um, but I know growing up and what I do, like school wasn't um, school came easy to me, and I want my kids to learn what effort is, and that that's what I'm gonna praise you off of over the result because you're gonna fall a lot, and I want you to keep getting back up.

SPEAKER_00 42:34

How about this one? I don't need to tell my wife I love her every day. She knows I love her.

SPEAKER_03 42:40

Yes, you do, and we still don't say it enough. I mean, my wife left. Um I haven't, I I probably haven't texted my wife in five days or more. I'd have to look back. Could have even been over a week. I haven't texted her I love her. Now I tell her I love her probably 30 times a day. But I think seeing it in in text, if you ask anybody's wife, like, hey, when was the last time your husband texts you I love you? She's probably gonna be like, Well, I don't know. You right? Like it's gonna be this. Um, I sorry that I sounded like that when I said but but really it matters. So, like, my wife left today.

SPEAKER_00 43:16

Chelsea, you don't sound like that.

SPEAKER_03 43:17

You don't sound like that at all, Chelsea. She left today at like 10 something, and I just was like, I she walked out, I said, I love you, you know, have fun, and then I just text her that same thing. Have fun, love you. And she didn't respond, she didn't say anything, and she doesn't have to. But not only telling her does she need to hear that, but you saying it feels good.

SPEAKER_02 43:44

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_03 43:45

And I think we miss that part sometimes. I think we think, Well, I don't need to say it because she already knows. But it's like, but if she told you she if she told you she loved you, would you tell her it back? And how would that make you feel? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 43:57

It's it's funny you you say that, you know. There was there was a long period of time when, you know, I was kind of in the the chaos of, you know, up and coming in business and learning, and just every day seemed like I was drowning. And to where I had set an alarm on my phone for 143 p.m. Cause 143 was I love you, uh stands for I love you. It's a kind of a thing between Natalie and I it's in our wedding vows. And and I talked about that on a previous podcast, and I had you know numerous men reach out to me and they're like, dude, I started doing this, and my wife's like, like, what what's going on? Like, what do you why do you keep texting me at the same time every day and doing and and they're like, I love it, but like I don't understand. Like, and so it it makes a difference. And again, it's like, what if if you need these tips and tricks, like set up set an alarm on your phone?

SPEAKER_03 44:52

Like, it's not gonna hurt anything. I think we're like, oh, but then it's obvious. Yeah, make it obvious. Yeah, and make it often. Yeah. Well, I got one. Okay. I'll be more present when things slow down.

SPEAKER_00 45:05

They never do. They never do. We just talked about this last week when it came to you know our faith routine and and um you know this idea that we always have more time. But all of us know that anytime we create more space of time, we always fill the gap with something else. And so, you know, to me being present is is an at intentional decision that we make. And so, like you know, when are things gonna slow down? Like when you're 65, 70, when you retire, like, and then what? Like I think whether you're 20, 25, 35, 45, like take advantage of now. And things don't things may never slow down. And typically when they do slow down, it's not a slowdown that you were expecting, which then bec creates more chaos within your life. And so I just would say go back to intentionality and you know, if it's important, you'll create the time for it. No, love that. Uh, last one here on this. I would say the how about the the man I i uh I don't know that I need to ask you the question on this, but I'd like to talk back and forth on this because I think you're the one that told me the story of you know the very successful businessman. Um the brothers spent all this time making money, building the business. You know, kids would ask him to do things, but he never had time, and then he sells the company for hundreds of millions and wants to take everyone out on a on a trip, on this big extravagant vacation, and invites his kids, and they're all like, We don't want to, we don't want to go with you. So it's like the idea of the man who builds financial legacy but has an emotional void, right, has ultimately failed the mission of leading his family.

SPEAKER_03 47:11

Well, and that's um that right there was actually something that I uh 2020, I would say, between 2019 and 2020. Um I I think a good thing for us to do is to put ourselves in the position to be that person, like have everything. And then who do I got to be to be that person? And what I did is I put myself in a position of like, okay, I've got the house, I've got the toys, I've got everything, I've got all the money, every single thing in the world. What is the worst thing that could happen in getting that? And the worst thing that could happen is I lose my wife and I lose my kids. And if I did, I placed myself in like, holy cow, I would go back and do it all over again if I could just get them back. And that transformed the way that I approached my family life. I do not want to lose my wife, I do not want my kids to not want to be around me. I would love for my kids to want to, you know, be around me for the rest of my life. And I want my wife to want to be with me forever. And in order to do that, I have to give them the best of me. And if I'm going after all these other things, then I'm giving the best someplace else. And I I don't have enough. I don't have enough of that to be to gain all of those things guarantee while sacrificing my family. I will not sacrifice my family. And I would hope that they see that, but in doing that, I realized that stuff didn't matter. I will tell Chelsea all the time if we had absolutely nothing, I knew that I I know that I have three people I can hold on to in that nothing. And we will figure it out.

SPEAKER_02 49:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 49:02

You know, for me, it's like this, you know, the the reframe in your mind of you know, your your family's not an obligation to manage, right? As a as a man and as a father, it's it's your life's mission to lead them. And for me, like being a a competitive person, and and some people may disagree with this point of view, you know, being a competitive person, like I'm constantly like challenging myself and seeing, you know, it's it's not a competition against other people, it's a competition against me of like, man, how well can I lead my kids to Jesus? Like, how well can I lead my wife and love my wife? How well can I create experiences for my kids? You know, it's like I I look at all these different aspects and it's like it becomes like a competition in my head of like, how can I create these opportunities? How can I create this growth? And some people may listen to this and be like, well, that's you don't have to be so competitive, or like you don't have to look at, but for me, like that's what that's what drives me. Like, at the end of the day, my why is my family and creating like a a one-of-one unique experience for life. And for me, it's like that's the competitive competitive edge that I bring to the table of like, how can I make this the best experience possible? And so it's like that shifting your mindset of like, oh, this is an obligation that I have to like this is my life's mission. Like, how can I make the most of it?

SPEAKER_03 50:38

I love that because that sounds like that makes it more fun. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 50:41

Well, I was almost, I was gonna say, like, you almost can gamify it. Yeah, and some people are like, that's kind of weird way to lead your family, but like not really.

SPEAKER_03 50:50

I mean, it's like sports, it sucks losing, right? It are sports fun when you lose every single game? No, are they fun when you win? Yeah. So if you're actually gamifying it, that means you're taking an approach to win. And you have a you have a benchmark, you have a a goal, right? And it's easy, it's easy to measure that in the sense of like go talk to your kids one-on-one. Hey, what do you is it fun when you dad? Like, what are some of the best moments you've had? What do you love? Like hearing their stories, um, I don't even think we do that enough is ask our spouse or ask our kids, how could I show up for you better?

SPEAKER_00 51:28

Yeah. All right, let's

Weekly Check-Ins And Daily Habits

SPEAKER_00 51:30

wrap this thing up. Let's give people like some actionable framework here. So hop down to uh segment four. Um, I'll go through the marriage piece, you hit the parenting, and then we'll just kind of give people some some daily action steps uh to go through that may help people take their next step. So from a marriage aspect, you know, a weekly marriage check-in. 20 minutes, no phone. Like there was uh, I know people that like put this on their calendar. Like this is their like Natalie and I used to do this for a period of time, like every Sunday. We this was kind of like our check-in time. And so people are like, Well, what like what does that look like? Like, ask your spouse, like, how are you feeling about us right now? Like, what do you need from me this week? Like, that's a big one. I think a lot, especially like in for like you and Chelsea and areas where like you guys actually do work together. Like, what do you need from me this week that's gonna help things go smoother? I know that's something that like you often will do, like when you see Chelsea's a little bit overwhelmed or something's going on. It's like, what can I take from your plate and knock these things out? Um, you know, what can I do better? And where are we building together? Like those are four simple questions that can create dialogue, communication, and help you take your next next steps. Um, you know, Natalie and I do a weekly date night, but maybe you your starting point is a monthly date night. Um, if you're not currently um scheduling like that intentional one-on-one time, like now's the time to start doing that. Um, you know, this is a big one for me. Uh I'm physical touch is my love language. Most guys. Yeah, most guys. Um so like that daily physical connection, holding hands, snuggling on the couch, whatever that looks like. Um, you know, that this is probably my message to women is like you've probably seen the Instagram videos where it's like my mind, this is it's like from a man's point of view, and it's like my mind when my wife touches me, and it goes from like this loud chaos going on to like they're driving and she puts her hand on his leg and the like this sense of calm peace comes over. Like, most women, unless you're intentional about it, don't realize what just like a simple hand on the head or hand on the leg or holding hands, like how far that goes with most men. Um, and then the last one is speaking her language, not yours. You know, so like for my wife, you know, it it's so simple. There's like things where it's like me loading the dishwasher at night and starting the dishwasher or cleaning stuff up off the countertops. Like when our house is is cluttered and which is every day with the kids, our kids at our age, like at their ages, you know, just a we call it closing time every night when the kids go to bed. We just we just pick things up real quick and like doing that together goes a long way for you know what what would be like her her love language, you know, between words of affirmation and acts of service, like those two things, you know. If I'm speaking, because physical touch is not hers. So like where I want to grab her and squeeze her and do all these, she's like, get I just mean get away from me. Um she doesn't say that, but um, it doesn't fill her cup the way it does for me, but doing these other things does. So that's where I need to focus my attention.

SPEAKER_03 55:00

Well, I would say on the parenting side, if you have multiple kids like we do, one-on-one time is huge. And I think that a lot of times we get caught up in the one-on-one time, but also with one-on-one parenting with both or all three, each parent taking all of them and then individually. And if you have a child, I think individual time and together time. So I think sometimes we miss out, you know, oh well, we all went to this place together. And it's like, but were you together? And I think like for my girls, they love like grabbing breakfast or grabbing a drink or getting and going on a car ride to a store. Basically, something I don't want to do is what they love. Um, now you might have boys and they're like, oh yeah, but then the mom's like, ah, I don't really want to do what they do. So it's stepping out of what you want and stepping into what what allows them to be their authentic self together and alone.

SPEAKER_00 55:58

Yeah. I mean, a good example of that was let last week or the week before Copeland was having just a hard day. You know, young boys have, you know, they have a lot of emotions, don't know how to deal with them. And Natalie just looked at me and was like, You just take them out one-on-one. And so we literally we grabbed a pack of hot dogs out of the fridge and we grabbed our fishing poles, and him and I went fishing. And he was like, Dad, this is the best day ever. And it was so simple, so simple.

SPEAKER_03 56:27

I love that. And and I think praying, praying with your kids and for your kids and over them. Uh, I don't think that we that we pray enough together. Um, I know that I with my youngest, we've prayed a lot more recently, but with my oldest, like she's going to bed way later than me. Um so it but that's a a thing. It's creating those rhythms. I think whether it's dinner together, um, you know, the bedtime routines, which I think when you're young, you have a routine that most parents are like, Oh, I hate this routine. But but it's creating these, okay. This is what we do at these times or on these days. Uh, and I think we all create and have routines. It's just a matter of are they helping or hurting us? And I think sometimes we we're hurting ourselves more than we are are helping. Um, so it's being intentional, and I think it's falling back onto who are we as a family? What are our values? What do we do? How do we act? How do we treat each other? And then we create that intentional time. Um, for us, where we are in our stage, is people are all over the place at all different times. I mean, right now, I'm pretty sure all four of us are at different locations. I think my daughter is at somebody's house, my oldest, my youngest is someplace else, my wife is out and I'm here. And instead of it being about, well, when we all get together or on Friday, we're all gonna sit together, it's when we see each other, we need to give each other our best. So if I see my oldest, I'm gonna crack a joke and give her a big hug, and she's like, ah, dad. And I'm I try to act like I I joke and I say when it comes to my family, I try to act like a dog. What I mean by that is when do you come home and your dog is not excited to see you?

SPEAKER_00 58:21

Never.

SPEAKER_03 58:22

So I come home, or when my kids come home, or my wife, I act so excited to see them. And to a fault, they would say, like, oh, it's so annoying. But really, if I didn't do it, that would probably be a sign.

SPEAKER_00 58:41

It's like when you walk by and you slap your wife's butt. Yeah, she's like, but then when you don't, she's like, Hey, what do you not like these pants? Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 58:51

A hundred percent. So I so for me, and I think that that came when um there's a lot of things I think that happened when when we're young. And for me, when Chelsea and I first got married, we lived in a little apartment. And when I we worked two different jobs, and I worked earlier and she worked later. So she would come home and I would run to the front door and I'd give her a big hug. And I did this for years. And she would always just be like, Oh, this is what he does. And at night, because of that, you were talking about love language. We held hands when we would fall asleep. And I remember at work, I would tell the girls that would work there, I'm like, Yeah, my wife and I do this. And they would always be like, Well, one day you're gonna stop. It's you're not gonna be like that. Like, and that's how they talked. They did they would oh so what ended up happening is people would always tell me, like, it changes in these things. And here's the truth it does change, but you don't have to change. Like, yes, are we falling asleep holding hands every night? No, we're not. But am I constantly aware that I could change and be somebody completely different that isn't who she married? Yes. Do I want to go as far away from changing to that person as possible? Yes. So will I will we still occasionally hold hands? Yes. Do I run to the front door and greet her? No, but do I make sure that I tell her I love her and high and you know something? Yes. So I'm very aware and intentional in how I act that it doesn't stray too far from who I say I am. And uh I think that that's a thing to ask yourself. Have you strayed away from who you were, that the person you're with fell in love with, that who you want your kids to believe you to be? Because you get to decide that.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:34

It's really good. Well, I hope some of this content was really helpful for you guys, and especially the ending here of just some easy action steps that you can apply, and um, you know, like like we started this podcast, family can be messy and it's and it's hard and it's chaos, and there's different seasons, and you had kids into the mix, and they're different ages, like it's just it's a lot, and so having some routines and a foundation to to walk along and and stand by goes a long way.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:08

So well, awesome.

Wrap Up And Whats Next

SPEAKER_03 1:01:10

Please subscribe, follow along. We've got week three next week of fitness, and then week four of leadership. So keep following along. If you missed week one, faith, take a listen, and uh we'll see you next time. See y'all, you know.